And the far right took that personally
This is where I fall off with liberals. “Lose the Trans talking points, they are holding the DNC back.”
How about first we try losing the DNC talking points. They’ve been in charge this whole time and I didn’t see trans people allow fascism to wash over the states while they were at the head of the government.
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You arent going to win any elections catering to 1% of the total population and alienating a large part of it. I would say that is just common sense politics at this point.
Protecting the rights of individuals is not catering to 1% of the total population. Its the bare minimum in a supposed civilized democracy. You can never, ever, compromise on protecting individuals that are causing no harm to others and just trying to navigate through the world.
Do we need to showcase the trans issue? No. We need politicians that are better at navigating the media environment and can effectively strategize against the GOP propaganda machine.
If you do that first, you wouldn’t have an issue with trans people. For fuck sakes make an attempt at it even and if they are capable and what I say is wrong, fine, expel the trans people from the party. Except, accept you will never be a party of values only one of opposition, so be cautious of ever trying to claim morality after that point.
In this case at this point in time it is. Progressives built their entire hosue of cards on trans and lgbtq rights and then popular opinion swung the other way and the little support they had evaporated in conjunction with their political power.
If its true their support has waned then the people in power are the exact people who deserve to be. You want to vote for dems because they wear blue not because you give a shit about principles.
I’m so glad your privy to my private thoughts. People like you are why everyone thinks progressives are fucking nutters.
What’s private? Did you not suggest the DNC abandon its trans platform?
I’m talking about your statement where you randomly decided I’m basically blue maga.
“non-trans” normal person here, and I think everyone who has a problem with trans / queer / whatever people is a fucking moron. I absolutely support the “trans agenda”
Gentle FYI for you today, the term for non-trans is cis or cisgender. 💜
I am fully aware what some people use, but it is a made-up word of the English language and I won’t apply it to myself. I don’t have a problem with people using it, but it’s not my vocabulary. It neither has an inherent sense, nor does it have any added value in most context. I respect that it helps to normalize specifying whatever gender one associates with when “cis” people also do it, as opposed to only having trans / non-binary people to specify “what” they identify as. But my solidarity extends only to full acceptance and tolerance, not to changing how I “identify” myself :p
but it is a made-up word of the English language
Interesting, because every word you’ve used is made-up word of the English language.
“Cis” is as real a word as “trans” is. They’re both Latin prefixes. Cisgender has literally no other meaning besides “not transgender”
No, that part (cis) is a prefix and means “on this side of”. And for “on this side of gender” to mean what cisgender is used as, is a newly agreed-upon thing in the evolution of LGBTQ culture.
But when you say things like ‘“non-trans” normal person’ it sounds like you’re saying it isn’t normal to be trans. Why not just say “non-trans” or “cis” instead of saying “normal person”?
You assume that in my world “normal” is a compliment. It’s not.
Well it certainly contributes to othering the people you don’t view as “normal”. Don’t use cis, whatever, but paired with you saying you specifically know cis is a term and you specifically choose not to use it, calling cis people normal certainly sounds transphobic. You’re following the conservative’s playbook. Don’t say cis people are the “normal” ones.
America has a majority of white people living there. Could you imagine if people started calling white people “normal”? The words you choose have consequences.
Again, I can’t make this clear enough, this isn’t some bullshit purity test. If you don’t wanna use the term cis to describe yourself, so be it, but don’t use normal. Especially when you’re already willing to use non-trans. Solidarity isn’t othering the persecuted.
Trademark? This doesn’t even make any sense. The person who posted this seems like a psychopath.
Not to be rude but this isn’t a meme
The trans agenda is not that simple. I support their right to exist. I am fully against the pipeline to trans that I’ve seen in schools. You are only allowed to encourage a confused teenager, if you push back at all you are fired.
I think
this ‘meme’the title of this post is a great example of what the problem really is. I do not have any issues with trans people. What I have a major problem with is that voicing an opinion, or have any form of meaningful debate, is met with immense aggression, trolling, cancelling, intimidation.I am for example not completely convinced about trans women in female sports and am sympathetic to arguments from both sides. Even voicing that will cause me to be vilified by one side.
Another example is transition care for children. I believe that at a young age making an irreversible choice is dangerous and we should be careful. Not saying care should abolished, just saying that such a big life decision needs extreme care because it can cause irreparable harm later in life. Again a reasonable, well willing position that will cause this to be downvoted into oblivion.
So, trans people, I support you to exist, be happy, live a meaningful life. But unfortunately there’s a group of loud people who are honestly behaving like psychopaths who are making it hard to stay sympathetic. Wake up.
(Edit) Wanted to share this NY times post that puts thing much more eloquent than I ever could: https://www.nytimes.com/2025/06/26/opinion/gay-lesbian-trans-rights.html
Another example is transition care for children. I believe that at a young age making an irreversible choice is dangerous and we should be careful.
… do you think transition care for minors is just handed out at the grocery store checkout or something?
“We need to be cautious!” would be much more compelling if the standard medical approach to trans minors was not already immensely cautious.
But unfortunately there’s a group of loud people who are honestly behaving like psychopaths who are making it hard to stay sympathetic. Wake up.
I dread to think of how quickly your sympathy would’ve been sapped for Black rights in the 1950s and 60s.
“We need to be cautious!” would be much more compelling if the standard medical approach to trans minors was not already immensely cautious.
The standard may be cautious, but a significant number of individual clinicians are not. But pointing out that a concerning number of care providers have looser-than-standard medical approaches gets the speaker attacked as a traitor to the cause.
Bolding mine, quite from https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2025/06/transgender-youth-skrmetti/683350/
When red-state bans are discussed, you will also hear liberals say that conservative fears about the medical-transition pathway are overwrought—because all children get extensive, personalized assessments before being prescribed blockers or hormones. This, too, is untrue. Although the official standards of care recommend thorough assessment over several months, many American clinics say they will prescribe blockers on a first visit.
People act like natal puberty is the neutral choice here - it’s not. The first wrong puberty made me actively suicidal and that’s not unusual. If a kid has gotten so far as to get to a doctor about this, it’s pretty clear that something is up (cis people generally don’t question their gender in the first place) and by waiting on puberty blockers you’re allowing further suffering and irreversible harm to a trans kid. Puberty blockers are a very low risk way of hitting pause and if the kid decides to go through with natal puberty they can just stop taking puberty blockers with no harm other than a delayed puberty.
Puberty blockers are an overwhelmingly safe way to buy time for a patient, fuck’s sake.
In regards to the whole trans women in sports thing: Sport doesn’t fucking matter. Let them play their little games if they want. Discouraging young people from healthy exercise just because some bigots care too much about who wins a meaningless contest is ridiculous.
I understand what you’re saying, and agree that discouraging young people to exercise is preposterous. But sports and competition do matter to a lot of people (especially in the US I think, which comes across way more competitive than Europe), and it’s not meaningless to them (neither to trans athletes I might add).
So I would say that your comment will be considered quite disrespectful. Would you say that this large group of people are more, or less inclined to agree with you if they’re being called a bigot?
average .ml L
Bash the red fash.
I rest my case.
Fuck your case.
No nuance for transphobia.
You should probably not use words that you don’t know the meaning of.
He literally said he supports us and that he wants to learn…
How in the world do you see anything he said as transphobic?
You sound extremely unreasonable right now…
Wrong place wrong time.
You’re vilified because you’re acting like a villain. People don’t want to debate your neckbeardedly presented well ahcktuallies while they’re fighting for the right to exist.
We don’t have this fight when it comes to other medical matters. Like if kids with cancer should get treatment even though chemo and surgery could have long-lasting repucussions. The alternative is they die. People who don’t get proper medical treatment die. Trans kids die of depression and suicide without treatment. Those are real things, there are real risks to not treating a medical condition. It’s not a matter up for public debate just because some dickwads are trying to distract everyone by making healthcare for a specific group of people political. It’s medical, we have facts and data that say trans people need healthcare to support their transition to live healthier longer lives. There are fucking doctors out there with years of practice who say yes, these kids need medical intervention. And here you are bitching that no one will debate you in a place where, again, people are fighting to exist. And you’re bringing up tired arguments because you gotta be that guy.
We have data on trans performance in sports and there is no clear advantage.
Besides, if you’re a world-class athlete, you already have a way different kind of body than most people. There are plenty of biological advantages that are celebrated in sports rather than weeded out. Want to start making sure everyone is the same height and weight for every sport, too? Same lung capacity? Reaction time? Born in the same country? Live at the same altitude? Same race? If you want to get advantages, there are clearer divisions along racial lines than trans status. No, I don’t advocate for segregation in sports because I’m not a goddamn monster of a person who can’t think for two seconds about why that’s idiotic.
Fuck off. Stop being a moron. Show some goddamn empathy.
How is anyone supposed to show empathy, let alone learn anything when even the slightest hint of wanting to have a conversation is met with this kind of reaction? I’m the villain? OK, but then you’re an extremist.
I made it clear in my comment what I support, and it was certainly not denying anyone’s right to exist. None of what I said supports the claim you made. What I pointed out is a major problem is exactly what you illustrate with your comment. It’s impossible to discuss anything when 2 sides are so entrenched and unwilling to debate. I get the urgency and gravity of what is happening right now, but for people like me, who consider themselves very sympathetic to the trans community, you’re making it very hard to help. It’s either support everything we say, or shut the f up. That’s never going to work.
And on the data you’re referring to around gender-affirming care, show me. Latest I heard, this is a very young field of study, and data, if any, is inconclusive. And yet here I am, supporting gender-affirming care, having to defend the position that please can we tread with care. Insanity!
As you (seem to) point out, trans people in sports is a different conversation. The science is clearer, but now we have a group of formerly (and frankly, still) marginalised people (women at birth, biologically) who fear unfair advantage. Much more political, philosophical even, a much harder debate. I empathise with both sides, how villainous of me.
So, showing empathy to you is hard. You reap what you sow.
Saying you’re supportive vs. actually doing the work to listen, understand, and be supportive, are much different things. Your empathy is performative if you don’t back up your words with actions, no matter how you dress up your opinions with empathetic-sounding statements.
Consider this: If you’re truly empathetic and open minded, why do you need to keep pointing it out?
The fact that you present an opinion piece from media owned by special interests to support your argument is enough to see why you believe what you do.
I have a group of friends, some of whom are trans, some of whom have medical degrees, and we have these discussions all the time. However, when someone talks about their right to exist being threatened, in a world where their right to exist is being threatened, is when you’ve decided to come in complaining about how poor you can’t engage in any polite discourse because people downvote you.
A number of people here have told you why this is the case, but you proceed to play the victim.
There are more than two sides, and no, the science on sports isn’t more clear than it is on gender affirming care. Even in the pub med links someone else posted, which they apparently hadn’t read in entirety, go into how controversies around trans identities is sports has become a solution in search of a problem. You should read those links.
I don’t know what about my post made you think I wanted or was willing to extend empathy to your point of view. Was it when I called you a moron or an idiot?
Hi. I’m not sure what data she’s referring to that shows trans women have no athletic advantage in sports.
I’m trans and I disagree completely.
I believe the issue at hand is, and always has been, male puberty.
I don’t want people who went through male puberty physically competing against people who haven’t.
Male puberty gives an advantage that is not really possible to “undo” completely.
https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC9331831/
https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC10641525/
Also, you are not bad for asking questions, or sharing your assumptions. I welcome them.
You mean well. That’s what matters.
Thank you.
Hey, thanks for this thoughtful response. This is basically what I’m seeing happening; I don’t think it’s a black and white, clear cut situation. On the one hand there’s trans people, who feel discriminated against on this matter, on the other hand there’s women who have similar sentiments on the same. And here I am agreeing with them both. An impossible position. Agreeing with one side is denying the other. I don’t see a solution to this and that really sucks.
I didn’t actually comment to ask questions to be honest, but to comment on the polarisation that is happening, and that folks who are sympathetic perhaps become less sympathetic when immediately being put away as Satan. That’s burning bridges which you can’t afford as a minority.
But, I’m happy I did comment because there’s also some really good insights here and thoughtful responses. I don’t know any trans people IRL, so it’s valuable to me.
Thank you
https://www.erininthemorning.com/p/the-moderate-case-against-trans-youth
https://www.erininthemorning.com/p/the-moderate-case-against-transgender
I should not have had to suffer through the first, wrong, puberty. I’m left with permanent scars, both physical and psychological, as a result. I’m not coming back to debate people who think thousands of trans kids should suffer the same way I did because one or two cis kids could be hurt. I damn near didn’t survive and a lot of trans kids don’t. Just dropping these links, I will not debate.
Hey, thanks for your comment and link. I respect that it must be incredibly hard having to suffer so much because of personal experience, and to then be expected to debate about it. I totally get that.
As the article says, there is a lot of misinformation around this, a lot of ignorance, and I do believe that an open debate about this (or anything in general really) is truly important. Way i see it, you’ve got bad actors on one side (opposing trans in this case) who will use anything to further their agenda. And they have an advantage: they can oversimplify a complex process. It’s really easy to shout “They want all your children to be trans!”, and quite a bit harder to explain the reality. That’s what the trans community is up against. It will take a lot of patience and time, decades, to educate the masses unfortunately, and any excesses, like online vitriol, trolling, will be used against you. I’m sorry to say this, but you’re an easy target.
Again, not expecting anyone to debate who doesn’t want to. But I hope that the people who do enter the public debate can be as composed as the author of the article you shared. I believe that’s the only road to acceptance.
I wish you all the best, and hope you can find peace. From the little information I have I can tell, you are beautiful.
it’s not 2014 anymore. we aren’t canceling anyone. we’re getting canceled. JKR is doing victory laps. NHS has banned HRT for minors, as have 27 states. we’re kicked out of the military, and forbidden from security clearances. teachers in Florida can’t even use their own pronouns. Medicaid/Medicare/ACA funding for HRT for adults is stripped now. we can’t get passports with the correct gender marker. Sarah McBride has to use the men’s bathroom in Congress. Newsom calls us freaks. conservative media is calling us groomers and every time there’s a mass shooter they spread the rumor the shooter was trans. “gender ideology” is the new Satanic Panic. NYT keeps running op-eds on why Dems should throw us under the bus. Nancy Mace shouted “tr*nny” three times on the House floor and wasn’t censured for it.
you really think we’re the ones holding the cards?
It’s not 2014 and yet this is a post about not supporting the trans agenda makes one a “fucking psychopath”.
What else do you call someone who wants to deny medical care for children and force them to go through irreversible changes?
With irreversible changes do you mean puberty?
Unfortunately puberty causes irreversible changes yes.
Now that doctors and parents en masse know trans people are a thing, if a child shows signs of gender dysphoria in early childhood, therapy is in order.
If the therapist determines the child is probably trans, and the (male) child insists they don’t want to grow up as a man, or vice versa, or whatever, and the parents feel like it’s not going to change and they’re more concerned with the child’s happiness than with some religious conviction or conservative values they may be clinging to…
The child should be given puberty blockers, which studies have shown do NOT cause irreversible damage.
As the child becomes a teenager and the situation stays the same… eventually it becomes obvious that some form of puberty needs to happen, and a choice has to be made. Usually this happens around 14 - 16 I believe.
It’s a tough decision, with many people involved, and the end result will be permanent irreversible changes to the teenager’s (soon to be adult’s) body.
If you force the child to go through a puberty they don’t want, you fuck them up… forever.
You destroy their life in a lot of ways. You condemn them to a life of harassment and rejection and isolation. Your own child.
This isn’t just mad doctors running around with meat cleavers going to town.
It’s a process that spans the child’s entire childhood, with thousands of opportunities to pump the breaks and change course, that if avoided in the name of something other than the child’s happiness and the doctors recommendations… will lead to tremendous misery and resentment.
I was born in the late 80s. My parents didn’t know what trans was. They took me to a conversion therapist when I was 5. Their solution for me was to “convince me to be normal”.
I grew up hating myself and feeling like a freak, because the feelings never went away, and I no longer felt safe talking about them… with anyone… so I was alone, hurting, in silence, watching my body change forever in ways I hated, trying to rationalize it all, imagining that one day I’d like the changes somehow.
That day never came.
I have been through a lot in my life. If my parents had known about transsexualism and gender transition, and supported me fully, my life would have been so much better.
I now have a whole host of mental issues that will haunt me until the day I die.
I want to love life. I want to see the good in people. It’s so hard when you’ve been through what someone like me has.
I am the direct result of your nervousness about treating children for gender dysphoria.
I am the alternative to supporting them.
Please don’t believe I am better off.
I’m not.
I am in psychological pain that never ends.
The joke, if you paid attention, is that the trans agenda isn’t a thing. They’re just trying to survive. So yeah, not supporting someone’s right to exist is some psychopathic behavior.
The fact thay you think there’s a trans agenda outside of just trying to survive doesn’t make you a psychopath, but it does make you an idiot.
I think if you want to be fair you make a distinction about policies you support based on your pov and how you treat the people you come across in your life. That could also make a difference to someone. Preferably by letting them know you’re ok with them existing without getting into a discussion about which policies you support and which you don’t.
For example, I could feel migrants take away our jobs and tell everyone I assume might be a migrant about my political views. That would make me a lot less of a pleasant human being than if I were to treat someone I assume is a migrant like the people I assume are not. Because to those people I also don’t start a conversation about how I feel about that.
I’m not accusing you of anything, but want to tell you that it is possible to come across people choose not to voice your opinion. Not just to prevent receiving that aggression, trolling, cancelling, intimidation you mention; but also because it might help someone feel relaxed when they’re around you.
I was only reacting to the title of the post, and I stupidly said ‘this meme’, that was a mistake. The content of the meme on it’s own I fully support. Apologies, thanks for pointing that out!
This, so much. There’re very real and important discussions in the medical field that (very candidly) go into these types of topics that become impossible to have (at least in the public discourse) due to these types of behaviours.
My stance is as they say in Poland.
Not my monkeys, not my circus. I just dont care.
It doesn’t affect me in the slightest, other than a minimal amount of the taxes i pay go towards treatment of their illness. Although, i find it slightly hypocritical that they are allowed to start changing gender before 18. Would seem that many other things should be allowed before 18 aswell in that case.
I can’t speak as to Polish law, but kids are allowed to do quite a bit before the age of 18 in the US. Going on puberty blockers - to delay a puberty that could damn well be an irreversible scar on the psyche - is hardly an opening for a shakeup of the legal position of minors.
Not Polish, its just a Polish saying.
I’m not convinced that a kid can make that judgement. Certainly not before puberty. But that might just be my own unwavering feeling of comfort in my own sex talking.
If a doctor makes a judgement of it, then my opinion doesn’t matter.
Puberty blockers aren’t OTC, they’re prescribed by doctors. The kid’s not making the judgement so much as they’re bringing up the medical issue to a professional.
I was diagnosed with depression at a fairly young age, just entering into my teens, but I only got in to see a psych to begin with because I was worried enough to self-advocate. Can’t really imagine what it would be like if I was told that I was too young to understand depression and turned out on my metaphorical ass.
