Being fired from your job over things you said has nothing to do with the right to free speech. That right means the government won’t punish you. It does not stop anyone else from punishing you.
But you can easily make the argument MSNBC is suppressing there own “journalists” speech to not face backlash from the government. Just because the government isn’t directly coming after an individual doesn’t mean that they aren’t at least attempting to suppress speech.
We’ve plenty of examples of Trump ignoring outlets he doesn’t favor. And I wouldn’t be surprised if he’s outright banned some from attending press events.
You mean like back in 2020-21, when the Biden admin was putting pressure on Twitter to ban anyone who was critical of their COVID policies, and they even ended up deplatforming the guy who pioneered mRNA vaccines?
Yup, that is classic suppression. Of course you could argue that is was for the benefit of public health as opposed to a witch hunt to get a bunch of people fired for not worshipping an alt-right propagandist.
You don’t think celebrating the murder of a political enemy on national TV isn’t setting a dangerous precedent to encourage more political violence from both sides? Do you really want to live in a world where people just get shot for having a different opinion from yours?
First of all no one did this on national TV. Perhaps you referring to edge lords on the Internet making snide or rude comments. This is nothing to worry about. I heard people talk about hanging or shooting Obama for several years when I lived in Idaho. Celebrating and fantasizing about killing the President did absolutely nothing.
Second, we already live in a society where the right wing is constantly calling for violence. They have been openly talking about killing people from the Democratic party for decades. Rush Limbaugh was particularly found of this and he received the Medal of Freedom.
Let’s be clear here, a couple of edgy people have celebrated his death. A lot of people recognize he was a piece of shit and are not upset at all other than to say no one should have to die this way.
The violent rhetoric comes regularly from the conservatives. Even the president of the United States sent a message he was bringing the Department of War to Chicago to enact an apocalypse. Kind of blows a few edge lords cheering on Kirk’s death out of the motherfucking water.
Well, since you can clearly tell the difference between talking about killing someone and actually killing them, I’m sure it won’t be too difficult to tell the difference between fantasizing about someone’s dead and actually celebrating it.
But the real problem is that while Kirk may have been a dunderhead, at least he was still willing to have a debate. The next guy they’re gonna send likely isn’t going to be so kind. You want fascism? Because killing the people who are willing to talk is how you get fascism.
No one is celebrating, this is the same lie told about Muslims celebrating 9/11. This is second rate propaganda and I am surprised you would peddle in this nonsense.
Kirk was much more than a dunderhead. Whatever the fuck that means. He was a hate monger and declared so by several reputable organizations. He is a horrible Martyr, one only a truly white supremacist could love.
I am under no illusion about fascism. We are a fascist nation that is slipping deeper into a techno feudalism state. I agree that Fascism thrives on violence. Going around killing people is what they already are doing. Just par for the course.
So many innocent children die every year needlessly thanks to gun proliferation. We should be collectively crying about this national loss we face year after year. It is now the number one killer of children outpacing motor vehicle collisions.
You literally said in your previous post that all the people who celebrated were edgelords, meaning there WERE people celebrating. Which is it? How about you get your own story straight before accusing me of peddling second-rate propaganda.
He was a hate monger
Whatever the fuck that means…
I agree that Fascism thrives on violence. Going around killing people is what they already are doing. Just par for the course.
Okay, so your plan for fighting fascism is doing the exact same thing that you say fascism thrives on… do you really expect that to work?
Instead we are trying to lionize a loser.
I’m certainly not trying to lionize him. I’m trying to get it through your thick head that making him a martyr for his cause was a phenomenally stupid idea, and everyone who was celebrating it is an absolute retard.
As objectionable and annoying as his words may have been while he was alive, none of them ever managed to fire up their base quite the way his death did. All this has accomplished is to pour oil on the fire. You thought fascism was bad now? Well, MAGA just got their Horst Wessel. It’s about to get way worse.
I just don’t think you should be able to say whatever you want without any consequences. Eg. Call someone a slur, get punched in the face. I don’t think that’s a violation of free speech
I also agree you should not be able to call people slurs. You should be punished but not by your employer.
But neither divisive nor hateful is a slur, neither are they inaccurate statements about Kirk. NBC most likely did not take the decision to fire the guy based on ethics.
Now let’s say another news anchor grows some balls and says “Israel is committing genocide” and their channel fires them. Do you also think it’s not a violation of free speech? That they should face consequences?
I am talking about free speech, not the second amendment, morality and ethics not US law.
Problem is there’s a big undertone of the administration penalizing news organizations that day things that are unwelcome. Interfering with their business dealings, limiting their access to information they need to provide coverage, bending things a bit to help out “news” outlets that are treating him well.
Being fired from your job over things you said has nothing to do with the right to free speech. That right means the government won’t punish you. It does not stop anyone else from punishing you.
But you can easily make the argument MSNBC is suppressing there own “journalists” speech to not face backlash from the government. Just because the government isn’t directly coming after an individual doesn’t mean that they aren’t at least attempting to suppress speech.
We’ve plenty of examples of Trump ignoring outlets he doesn’t favor. And I wouldn’t be surprised if he’s outright banned some from attending press events.
What if the government is putting pressure on the organization.
Then it becomes a free speech issue.
You mean like back in 2020-21, when the Biden admin was putting pressure on Twitter to ban anyone who was critical of their COVID policies, and they even ended up deplatforming the guy who pioneered mRNA vaccines?
Yup, that is classic suppression. Of course you could argue that is was for the benefit of public health as opposed to a witch hunt to get a bunch of people fired for not worshipping an alt-right propagandist.
You don’t think celebrating the murder of a political enemy on national TV isn’t setting a dangerous precedent to encourage more political violence from both sides? Do you really want to live in a world where people just get shot for having a different opinion from yours?
First of all no one did this on national TV. Perhaps you referring to edge lords on the Internet making snide or rude comments. This is nothing to worry about. I heard people talk about hanging or shooting Obama for several years when I lived in Idaho. Celebrating and fantasizing about killing the President did absolutely nothing.
Second, we already live in a society where the right wing is constantly calling for violence. They have been openly talking about killing people from the Democratic party for decades. Rush Limbaugh was particularly found of this and he received the Medal of Freedom.
Let’s be clear here, a couple of edgy people have celebrated his death. A lot of people recognize he was a piece of shit and are not upset at all other than to say no one should have to die this way.
The violent rhetoric comes regularly from the conservatives. Even the president of the United States sent a message he was bringing the Department of War to Chicago to enact an apocalypse. Kind of blows a few edge lords cheering on Kirk’s death out of the motherfucking water.
Well, since you can clearly tell the difference between talking about killing someone and actually killing them, I’m sure it won’t be too difficult to tell the difference between fantasizing about someone’s dead and actually celebrating it.
But the real problem is that while Kirk may have been a dunderhead, at least he was still willing to have a debate. The next guy they’re gonna send likely isn’t going to be so kind. You want fascism? Because killing the people who are willing to talk is how you get fascism.
No one is celebrating, this is the same lie told about Muslims celebrating 9/11. This is second rate propaganda and I am surprised you would peddle in this nonsense.
Kirk was much more than a dunderhead. Whatever the fuck that means. He was a hate monger and declared so by several reputable organizations. He is a horrible Martyr, one only a truly white supremacist could love.
I am under no illusion about fascism. We are a fascist nation that is slipping deeper into a techno feudalism state. I agree that Fascism thrives on violence. Going around killing people is what they already are doing. Just par for the course.
So many innocent children die every year needlessly thanks to gun proliferation. We should be collectively crying about this national loss we face year after year. It is now the number one killer of children outpacing motor vehicle collisions.
Instead we are trying to lionize a loser.
You literally said in your previous post that all the people who celebrated were edgelords, meaning there WERE people celebrating. Which is it? How about you get your own story straight before accusing me of peddling second-rate propaganda.
Whatever the fuck that means…
Okay, so your plan for fighting fascism is doing the exact same thing that you say fascism thrives on… do you really expect that to work?
I’m certainly not trying to lionize him. I’m trying to get it through your thick head that making him a martyr for his cause was a phenomenally stupid idea, and everyone who was celebrating it is an absolute retard.
As objectionable and annoying as his words may have been while he was alive, none of them ever managed to fire up their base quite the way his death did. All this has accomplished is to pour oil on the fire. You thought fascism was bad now? Well, MAGA just got their Horst Wessel. It’s about to get way worse.
Constitutional right to free speech? Yes. The overall philosophical concept of free speech? Less so.
It’s just that only one side gets punished for it.
Unless you think we were endowed by our Creator with certain unalienable Rights.
In which case the law is only there to enforce what we already own. And the concept of “Free Speech” goes past just laws.
Yes, some people misunderstand it. And others are too quick to “correct” them, even when their target is off.
Nobody is saying firing him was illegal.
Thank you! Seems like very few people understand the concept of free speech.
It doesn’t mean you can say whatever you want with no consequences, which is seeming what a lot of people believe
No, you are conflating the first amendment, a limited protection of free speech, with free speech itself.
It is very much a violation of free speech, its just not illegal. It still is immoral.
EDIT: fixed second amendment to first amendment
I guess I misunderstood something here.
I just don’t think you should be able to say whatever you want without any consequences. Eg. Call someone a slur, get punched in the face. I don’t think that’s a violation of free speech
I also agree you should not be able to call people slurs. You should be punished but not by your employer.
But neither divisive nor hateful is a slur, neither are they inaccurate statements about Kirk. NBC most likely did not take the decision to fire the guy based on ethics.
Now let’s say another news anchor grows some balls and says “Israel is committing genocide” and their channel fires them. Do you also think it’s not a violation of free speech? That they should face consequences?
I am talking about free speech, not the second amendment, morality and ethics not US law.
*first amendment
Though some do conflate guns with free speech as well…
Thanks for the correction, my bad
Problem is there’s a big undertone of the administration penalizing news organizations that day things that are unwelcome. Interfering with their business dealings, limiting their access to information they need to provide coverage, bending things a bit to help out “news” outlets that are treating him well.