I can’t really comment on the rest of what you said but calling modern day road cars uncomplicated is kind of ridiculous. The technicians are pretty much electrical engineers at this point. Between software and can bus stuff, cars are ridiculous right now. It’s making it very difficult for independent mechanics to work on vehicles.
That’s just a load of horse-hockey that older mechanics say because they hate modern vehicles. Techs are not electrical engineers just because they understand how a multimeter works and many places will just replace harness and stuff wholesale instead of repairing them, to the point where if I want to make one of my side signals work again I’m going to have to cannabilize a parts car for that section. Even still, it’s just lining up the wires and busting out the solder and heat-shrink.
I have a 2015 BRZ and do the work in my parents’ driveway. I know my car is less complicated than an Audi or VW but from personal experience those cars are garbage designed by engineers of questionable skill but a large budget.
The main reason independent techs have a hard time, I’d imagine, has more to do with how weirdly packaged the wires could be and without manufacturer support(for a warranty job, say) it might get financially difficult. Unplugging harnesses is not that hard otherwise.
So you only work on your one car, admit other vehicles are more complicated, but say only older techs complain about current cars? And who even said anything about complaining. You’re way off base my friend.
Yo the first claim was that the F1 mechanic takes their own car to a mechanic. So, that part is equivaleny and very “on base”. I also already conceded that I totally get it if they just mechanic stuff all day and don’t want to go home just to work on their own vehicle. Modern vehicles have more parts, for sure, but they are not prohibitively complex, especially for a professional race car mechanic. Besides, those big jobs rarely happen, if ever, and most of the time you’re just changing brakes, spark plugs, headlights, etc. and any schmuck with some hand tools and a Youtube video should be able to do that as long as they aren’t brain-dead.
So I don’t know why you’re looking to be so mad, maybe you feel like you’re part of the “brain-dead” portion and are feeling attacked, but buddy I’m consistent and staying relevant to the conversation.
The F1 thing has nothing to do with what I said. And yes, many of them are prohibitively complex, including software. Which is why the right to fix stuff even exists. I run a shop at a high end dealership. We are well beyond spark, fuel, and air being the only.relevant contributors.
“Yo the first claim” refers to what prompted me to enter this thread.
You run a shop and you don’t understand that simple, common jobs are easy enough to handle on your own? That, or maybe you work for a manufacturer so bad they regularly see vehicles come in for insane problems?
I dunno, I drive Subarus and they’re super easy, even a pleasure, to work on and there really hasn’t been much getting in my way so far. I fully agree that nothing should be locked away and people deserve the right to do their own repairs but even with that not being the case I also don’t completely give up on small jobs because a repair I’ll never do is not currently possible.
No. Some jobs are easy. Some are not. Some are in the middle. But just because your Subaru is easy to you, doesn’t mean a hybrid performance vehicle is easy. You are over generalizing based on garbage anecdotal evidence. You should stop doing that in life.
Hey, I’m not trying to say your job is easy or act like you don’t deserve to be compensated well for it, and I haven’t said that people shouldn’t ever go to a shop, but there are many jobs that just aren’t that bad. Unless it’s a German vehicle, of course, those cars are actively hostile towards anyone and everyone and their engineers should be ashamed of themselves. I’ve done way too many VW rear brakes for family and friends and it always sucks ass, though I get it done all the same.
I have to take out like 3 parts in my truck to get to the lightbulb to change it. That’s not super approachable. Then don’t even get me started on the electrical systems and what board controls what system. I like working on engines and such, cars are full of so much more now though.
Ok? So take them out, then? Like, I agree that cars are being packaged in some unfriendly ways but honestly I’ve always driven Subarus so it’s not really an issue for me as their engineers are actually considerate and clever enough to keep things simple(or at least relatively simple). I can even do my sparkplugs without having to lift the engine like everyone claims must be done(and maybe that’s a sign the bar is pretty low, I dunno) though either way, with iridium plugs it’s every 100,000km so whatever.
Modern cars have a lot of systems but ultimately if you just follow the instructions you can usually get where you need to go without much pain. Well, mental pain but you will probably bleed somewhere in there and that’s just part of the ✨experience✨.
I can’t really comment on the rest of what you said but calling modern day road cars uncomplicated is kind of ridiculous. The technicians are pretty much electrical engineers at this point. Between software and can bus stuff, cars are ridiculous right now. It’s making it very difficult for independent mechanics to work on vehicles.
That’s just a load of horse-hockey that older mechanics say because they hate modern vehicles. Techs are not electrical engineers just because they understand how a multimeter works and many places will just replace harness and stuff wholesale instead of repairing them, to the point where if I want to make one of my side signals work again I’m going to have to cannabilize a parts car for that section. Even still, it’s just lining up the wires and busting out the solder and heat-shrink.
I have a 2015 BRZ and do the work in my parents’ driveway. I know my car is less complicated than an Audi or VW but from personal experience those cars are garbage designed by engineers of questionable skill but a large budget.
The main reason independent techs have a hard time, I’d imagine, has more to do with how weirdly packaged the wires could be and without manufacturer support(for a warranty job, say) it might get financially difficult. Unplugging harnesses is not that hard otherwise.
So you only work on your one car, admit other vehicles are more complicated, but say only older techs complain about current cars? And who even said anything about complaining. You’re way off base my friend.
Yo the first claim was that the F1 mechanic takes their own car to a mechanic. So, that part is equivaleny and very “on base”. I also already conceded that I totally get it if they just mechanic stuff all day and don’t want to go home just to work on their own vehicle. Modern vehicles have more parts, for sure, but they are not prohibitively complex, especially for a professional race car mechanic. Besides, those big jobs rarely happen, if ever, and most of the time you’re just changing brakes, spark plugs, headlights, etc. and any schmuck with some hand tools and a Youtube video should be able to do that as long as they aren’t brain-dead.
So I don’t know why you’re looking to be so mad, maybe you feel like you’re part of the “brain-dead” portion and are feeling attacked, but buddy I’m consistent and staying relevant to the conversation.
The F1 thing has nothing to do with what I said. And yes, many of them are prohibitively complex, including software. Which is why the right to fix stuff even exists. I run a shop at a high end dealership. We are well beyond spark, fuel, and air being the only.relevant contributors.
“Yo the first claim” refers to what prompted me to enter this thread.
You run a shop and you don’t understand that simple, common jobs are easy enough to handle on your own? That, or maybe you work for a manufacturer so bad they regularly see vehicles come in for insane problems?
I dunno, I drive Subarus and they’re super easy, even a pleasure, to work on and there really hasn’t been much getting in my way so far. I fully agree that nothing should be locked away and people deserve the right to do their own repairs but even with that not being the case I also don’t completely give up on small jobs because a repair I’ll never do is not currently possible.
No. Some jobs are easy. Some are not. Some are in the middle. But just because your Subaru is easy to you, doesn’t mean a hybrid performance vehicle is easy. You are over generalizing based on garbage anecdotal evidence. You should stop doing that in life.
Hey, I’m not trying to say your job is easy or act like you don’t deserve to be compensated well for it, and I haven’t said that people shouldn’t ever go to a shop, but there are many jobs that just aren’t that bad. Unless it’s a German vehicle, of course, those cars are actively hostile towards anyone and everyone and their engineers should be ashamed of themselves. I’ve done way too many VW rear brakes for family and friends and it always sucks ass, though I get it done all the same.
I have to take out like 3 parts in my truck to get to the lightbulb to change it. That’s not super approachable. Then don’t even get me started on the electrical systems and what board controls what system. I like working on engines and such, cars are full of so much more now though.
Ok? So take them out, then? Like, I agree that cars are being packaged in some unfriendly ways but honestly I’ve always driven Subarus so it’s not really an issue for me as their engineers are actually considerate and clever enough to keep things simple(or at least relatively simple). I can even do my sparkplugs without having to lift the engine like everyone claims must be done(and maybe that’s a sign the bar is pretty low, I dunno) though either way, with iridium plugs it’s every 100,000km so whatever.
Modern cars have a lot of systems but ultimately if you just follow the instructions you can usually get where you need to go without much pain. Well, mental pain but you will probably bleed somewhere in there and that’s just part of the ✨experience✨.